RE: Re: Topic for discussion: getting along

From: debadger <debadger_at_pacbell.net_at_hypermail.org>
Date: Tue, 29 Jun 2004 22:23:19 -0700

Very true, a difference of opinion is just that; it needn't degenerate into
a fight.

I'm on a couple of 3d modeling/graphics program lists and last year someone
commented on one of the best animator's books - he objected to some of the
nudity so he asked his older sister to black them out for him. From his tone
of typer some of us mistook him for a 12 year old, although someone asked if
he was considerate enough to black out the male nude photos that are also in
there to protect her virtue? Someone else though, remarked that it would be
a pity to destroy a good resource but if the kid was only 12 perhaps he
might need to do it to keep from freaking out some adults.

The discussion was surprisingly civil for the first few days, and the
question revolved more around "what is the worth of the nude and life
drawing to a digital artist?" Well, of course if you're going to model
realistic or even semi-realistic humans and other animals the worth is -
vital. Life drawing not only teaches you to see clearly it gets you over
some of your hangups about the shape of a human. Then the rabid religious
types started sounding off, sadly there are some and they're very noisy and
pushy passive agressive pests.

There is a lot of gratuitous nudity and mild porn on the 3D sites - most are
poor copies of Vallejo and Frazetta, ho hum. Everyone, from 'decline to
state' to people who didn't get born right the first time agreed a) there's
a lot of gratuitous mildly sexy nudity b) you really should warn a casual
visitor to the site, because they just might have their little kids in the
room. Which was interesting, really, because there are a lot of folks who
wrote that they had co-workers giggling hysterically over the blue-nosed
poster's original comment. One Dutchman remarked that that is how kiddy
porn types are born, people who obsess too much about this sort of thing.

Where we all disagreed, sometimes intensely, was whether or not nudity is
automatically "evil" or merely some kinds of it. Now, an animation book
with neutral poses of nudes is, to anyone with any sense, a normal and
proper thing to see. A nude giving itself a clinical exam... I don't want
to see, I really don't. And a thong is just plain wrong, not to mention
painful, why anyone would want to see that I don't understand. I did find
that a civil tone of typer made it possible to carry on a conversation with
even a strongly religious originally anti-nude poster. He actually did
change his mind and allow that perhaps there are times when a nude photo is
appropriate. By and large the general tone of typer remained civil.

Then, when the conversation started to wind down, one extreme 'born-again
type' loudly chastised the entire list for daring to disagree with a
"modest, upright Christian young man" - implying, of course, that none of us
were modest or morally upright. The original poster, who had kept quiet,
piped up that actually he was 21 but he'd asked his mom to black out the
pictures for him. Several other "Christians" (who give the rest a bad name)
immediately sounded off in agreement and the moderator finally stopped the
"conversation" because it had been hijacked to a screaming match.

Another list I'm on, a spinning (yarn) list, had a poster object to
something she perceived as "anti-Christian" and some semi-pagan remarks
about 'blessed be' in the tag line. The only "Anti-Christian" post wasn't -
merely a woman remarking that her daughter, raised in Holland and very open
minded, would find the atmosphere stifling at a blue-nosed Christian
oriented college she'd gotten a scholarship to. They were glad she'd found
this out before committing to the place for four years. The moderator, who
permits no flaming at all, retaliated by saying henceforth there shall be NO
religious comments of any kind including in tag lines. I've noticed one
poster using "yours in firth, so-and-so" I'm tempted to ask her if she's
living with the Loch Ness monster in the Firth of Forth....

I am so tired of these passive-agressive pests who start a tirade, get upset
when told we're not interested, then scream that they're being persecuted
when they're told again to Knock It OFF! Go lions, go lions!! (poor things
probably got indigestion though) <grin>

Elena
Received on 2004-06-29 22:17:08