I have no love for "cults". But it is sometimes a sticky wicket to define
just what a "cult" is.
There have been many times that so-called Cult Leaders have made the
plausible claim that the major religions are simply more successful "cults".
A lot of these groups are started by creative brilliant insightful people.
Who unfortunately do not care very much about other human beings. A lot of
gifted people can also be.... assholes.
But, one should still be very careful about branding someone as mentally
suspect because they choose to join an "out of the mainstream" spiritual
path.
By the way, what is the name of that group that looks the other way when
prepubescent kids are molested by many of the church's powerful ????? :)
Lenny
----- Original Message -----
From: tschibasch <tschibasch_at_yahoo.com>
To: <OliveStarlightOrchestra_at_yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Friday, July 23, 2004 10:48 AM
Subject: [OliveStarlightOrchestra] Re: New database: horror films
> I was at this event Dean menioned, in early 1981. I ended up taking
> the EST training. I have no regrets about it.
>
> Yes, they are very pushy and try to make you take the training. And
> they claimed that if you said "NO" to them, they would lay off. The
> reason they would persist is that most folks don't say this. Rather,
> most people said "I don't think so", or "Not right now". These of
> course can be shot down, and you can be pushed into taking it. I think
> if you just say "NO" and don't qualify it, they will lay off.
>
> Be firm!
>
> Okay, so since I took the training, I will answer two questions.
>
> Question #1: Was it brainwashing?
>
> Answer: It had that feel to it. They presented a picture of the world.
> Some of it made sense, and some of it didn't. People argued with them.
> It was interesting. Sometimes wretchedly boring. We got there at 8AM
> and left at midnight. There were two breaks for meals and three for
> bathrooms. Though they were not mean, they did not let us take
> bathroom breaks during the presentation. There were no wall clocks,
> and we could not wear watches!
>
> I did not always like the presentation, but I agreed with many of the
> points they made. And I think it was in many ways less stupid than the
> religious stuff I was raised with when I was growing up. I was not
> allowed to take bathroom breaks when I was in church either!
>
>
> Question #2: Would I be the same person today if I had not taken EST?
>
> Answer: Maybe. I don't know. One point that EST made clear to me that
> I never got told at home was that we are responsible for our actions.
> So if your life is a mess, the fault is yours. This sounds pretty
> basic, but there are many folks out there that have screwed up lives
> and blame everyone else (parents, government, etc).
>
> In the end, I appreciate that I took EST since at least I know what it
> was like. If I had not, I would be wondering if I had missed something.
>
>
> John
>
> --- In OliveStarlightOrchestra_at_yahoogroups.com, "Hiram Gonash"
> <okfreddy_at_h...> wrote:
> > And my interest in cults started about the time...ummm...when some
> > friends tried to get me (and Keith and Susan and Jennifer) to take
> > est.
> >
> > Fond memories of going to the Graduation/Intro lecture and not being
> > allowed to leave without (a) either signing up for the course or (b)
> > facing a merciless barrage of antagonism if you chose not to sign up
> > for the course.
> >
> > I chose (a) but stated I didn't have any money, credit cards, or a
> > checkbook with me. They provided me a blank check! All I had to do was
> > fill in the bank number when I got home. Such foresight! I escaped the
> > lecture relatively unscathed, went home, and - ooops - never filled
> > out the check. A week later I got a call from est asking for the money
> > and ended up talking to the person for two hours (seriously) on why I
> > should take est. It boiled down to me needing to get "it". I replied
> > that I already had "it". They countered with I needed to make sure it
> > was the right "it". I parried and counterthrusted with "No, YOU need
> > to make sure you have the right 'it' so you need to take MY seminar
> > for $100. What a deal!" And that ended that.
> >
> > Keith, on the other hand, chose (b) and found himself literally
> > surrounded by a bunch of est goons who simply wouldn't take his "No!"
> > for an answer. Very non-estian actions for those folks. I still don't
> > know how he got out of it without bloodshed.
> >
> > And I remember a Samohite named Glen at the Graduation. He wanted to
> > be a policeman...
> >
> > Definitely bad times at Ridgemont High, though I think I gained a
> > girlfriend at the time out of the situtation. Hmmm.
> >
> > -H.G.
> >
> > --- In OliveStarlightOrchestra_at_yahoogroups.com, "Michael Marinacci"
> > <mikalm_at_i...> wrote:
> > > > Wow. Brings back memories.
> > > > Hmmm... are most Olives also est'ified?
> > > >
> > >
> > > Not I, O Pallid One.
> > >
> > > Actually, my fascination with cults and brainwashing probably
> > started with
> > > the rise of est and the more authoritarian elements of the "Human
> > Potential
> > > Movement" during my Seventies teenhood. The phenomenon of wealthy,
> > > well-educated hipsters -- people who would have run screaming from
> > anything
> > > resembling traditional Judeo-Christian spirituality -- subjecting
> > themselves
> > > to far more oppressive, mind- and soul-raping treatment at the hands
> > of
> > > various self-appointed gurus, is a phenomenon that still puzzles me.
> > >
> > > I guess everybody's got to believe something. Me, I believe I'll
> > have
> > > another beer! :-)
>
>
>
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
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>
>
Received on 2004-07-23 15:51:36